Why would I want to go through the unbelievable hassle of explaining myself to a bunch of know-nothing bureaucrats and internal medicine doctors who dont know their ass from their elbow about depression beyond some laughably simplistic characterization of the disorder in a diagnostics manual? Ill continue to go by the book until such time as the rules change, or I wish to no longer fly. Personally, I feel that if I am medically safe enough to drive then I should be safe enough to fly. Fortunately with the airlines, there is always a second pilot capable of flying the plane. But, it was not the fault of the FAA, it was mine for not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it. I guess it was a bit negligent on my part to get so far into before getting the medical. Hmmm Wiley Post was one of the great Aviators flue around the world was he Illeagle??? While a diabetic can develop hypoglycemic coma, a cardiac patient faint from an arrhythmia, or a patient become mentally impaired from an excessive dose of a medication, the real world evidence does not support that such incidences are common enough to recommend banning driving by those with such medical conditions. Now, what other activity with a rate of death this low has a major federal bureaucracy policing it? Requesting Medical Records. I can understand, in the last 5 years, but most of my things are now 20 years old and I still have to report them-no change. They always do it under the banner of safety. Im also struggling with depression. A pilot might reason, for example, that the antidepressant he's taken for months hasn't caused any side effects and actually makes him more mentally fit to fly, a safer pilot. Port St. Lucie, FL 34988 Lets assume 10%, which is probably a high figure. So, easing up on the medical requirements would be based on real world situations. However, the overriding principle here is that if you intentionally falsify your medical and are discovered, then you are done permanently. Im a 24 year old healthy male non smoker athlete with 20/20 vision and I cant fly because I took adderal as needed for help concentrating in school. The AME certified you as ok to fly, now the feds second guess him. I refer them to my TMI rule; if it was transient, dont say it. Anymore stringent than the First Class Medical is now would end up grounding many older pilots. In other words, bigger name on the other line. I am not an AME but am a flying physician with long experience chairing and serving on the EAA Aeromedical Council. Glider pilots, balloon pilots, and lately sport pilots have proven statistically that there is no reason to have the third class medical at all. How about the person that might have some minor anxiety issues? Your AME will review your MedXPress application in detail and conduct a physical exam. Aviation medicals protect your lifeand a periodic physical is smart. there would be no one to fly these jumbo jets. You and I both know our government never needs to justify their efforts.lol. This is why sometimes it becomes necessary to avoid telling the attending physician more than is necessary least the physician spin the whole condition in different light by making a mountain out of a mole hill, thereby destroying the flying career of the pilot for something that even the physician himself or herself is not sure about. The additional costs associated with FAA medicals will reduce flying time for many of us there goes the proficiencey issue again. What was yours for if you dont mind me asking. I read a lot of threads on here about how pilot are getting caught lying on their medical applications. None of the above activities has any significant medical requirement. AFAIK the FAA considers ADHD medications a serious issue. Well maybe a little? It was a more difficult process than if I had done it 20 years prior. Sure BUT would that condition really effect his flying? This article does not in any way counsel the reader as to how to appropriately respond to questions on the FAA medical application, nor does it give medical advice regarding the accuracy of the readers medical history. Before every flight (sometimes several per day) I self qualify myself THAT IS MY RESPONSIBILITY AS PIC!!! Meanwhile the FAA now sits on thier collective thumbs deciding what to do. In the latest installment of The Great Debate, Richard Collins asks you to weigh in on whether pilots are truthful when they visit the AME. Bicycle accident deaths 700 I dont care who you are if you tell me that you have never been diagnosed with anything then you are the liar. The flight will continue without further incident. Always wondered if the stress from taking the medical had anything to do with it. Before submitting your application, you will be required to review the penalties above, certify that you know the FAA will be scrutinizing your medical history, and authorize the National Driver Register to provide the FAA with a copy of your driving record. Died of a massive heart attack. Perfect safety is impossible, and an excessive attempt to achieve it will conflict with freedom. If thats not a bigger threat to safety, I dont know what is. They were like so we dont think you ever had it Passed tests with flying colors. Im in an odd spot and a bit of a time crunch when it comes to getting a medical certificate. Note, denial is different from deferral. Seems arbitrary to me. Everyone should say they have been dizzy. I completely agree with you. Before I was flying my previous HMO physician told me I was the perfect patient for the insurance company because I hadnt shown up for seven years. Telling the truth in MedXPress is clearly the right thing to do, but that is not what this article is about. Insurance companies now have a way out of paying the claim and if there were passengers or other property damage involved now lawyers get involvedsomething to think about! Therefore, I lied. In our opinion, and even for a moment disregarding the morality of lying and putting yourself, your passengers, and anyone elses safety at risk, it simply isnt worth lying despite the low chances of getting caught. As they say the truth eventually comes out but sometimes lies can go untold forever and I believe there are pilots who are flying around in our airspace with disqualifying medical conditions that should be special issuance or not even have a medical. Others accept what the agency is trying to do'protect everyone's best interests'and play by its less-than-perfect rules. Returning home, the Civil Aviation Medical Board cleared me for flying. In-case if you ever get into an accident the FAA/NTSB will look through all your medical history and do a thorough check on that pilot meaning they want to look at every doctor visit and all medications you have been on. Some records reviewer in OKC can not guarantee those in my aircraft a safe journey only I can do that. Ask your AME to call Oklahoma City and ask to speak with a physician about your case. Doesnt this seem grossly out of proportion? Most major airlines are in negotiations at this time, and many are contentious. Thats out of tens of millions of flights. Thats a good way to get into a LOT of trouble. 99.999999% of pilots can and should self-certify for 3rd class flying. I really want to fly but Im not sure my passion, not to mention my wallet, will be enough to get me through this process. In our experience, only a small minority of pilots actually try to maliciously conceal significant active medical problems. I believe those with conditions that would be considered a problem while flying (vertigo, blackouts, narcolepsy, use of medications that cause side effects that present without warning and could be debilitating, etc.) One assault charge, not so much. In certain circumstances, I wouldnt think twice about lying on the medical form, quite frankly. He was the author of numerous books, including. The 3rd class medical crosses the line where freedom is unreasonably denied in the pursuit of absolute safety. The other is you tell the FAA about something. I hope the AOPA and the EAA will also move quickly, and I want to thank both organizations for this effort. Most of us fly for recreation and a burning fire within to fly, and the Sport program can be just the ticket. Accident investigators at every crash look for signs of incapacitation and collect items such as medication containers to try to determine if a medical reason caused the crash. Many pilots get away with submitting false information on their MedXPress applications. Your email address will not be published. Type 2 diabetes, with oral medication, receiving a special issuance every year, until this last one, when the FAA generously determined my AME could recertify me, annually, for five years. The 8500-8 of necessity must be brief and it is very difficult to get authorization to change it. Dont take it personally, those are just the facts on the ground. A. Also, if I lose my medical, Id save a ton of money on flying and could retire a good 10-15 years earlier! Pilots lying on the there 1st 2nd and 3rd class medicals happens all the time, and it happens just as much as people going to MEPS for the Military. Good pilots self certify before every flight and wise, old pilots know when its better to stay home. If you can afford to own or rent an airplane, you can afford to pay an AME. There is a good chance you can hide some minor medical problems or even some major ones that you recovered from years ago. Every single pilot lied on their medical form. All FAA medical certificate applicants are required to acknowledge that warning before submitting their application in MedXPress. Since I asked to have myself tested for apnea, and found it was a problem, and now use a Constant Positive Air Pressure (CPAP) machine, FAA dogs me annually. The rules here have not changed, but the enforcement will now result in a 30 day ban from APC for violations. The hypocrisy at the FAA hurts general aviation in lots of ways. Ive no choice but be truthfull,but I am sure Ive flown with other pilots who are afraid of admitting or just dont admit that they are not fit to fly themselves or their passengers safely.Does that ache youve been noticing or even worse ignoring mean something? If you were diagnosed with ADHD when you were in school but havent taken medication or experienced symptoms in 15 years, you still are required to answer yes to question 18m. My driving record is perfect, but I have been wondering if the FAA will reject my certificate because of an assault charge that happened five years ago back when I was in highschool. But the feds harass pilots, not drivers, because they can get away with it with pilots but not with drivers. Im healthy, but had been to the doc a number of times over the last couple years (or whatever the reporting period was), for inconsequential (for flying) things, so, just reading the med form, as it said I could, I attached a sheet with all those doc visits. The FAA can get your records from Social Security if you are on Medicare. I am a rental pilot as well, and unfortunately, there are no sport rentals available, and they are too expensive to buy. Multiple assaults or domestic convictions might indicate some psychiatric disturbance that requires looking into. Home | About | Contact | Copyright | Report Content | Privacy | Cookie Policy | Terms & Conditions | Sitemap. An exam for a third class medical certificate with a student pilot certificate can cost between $75 and $150. If I dont tell him would the FAA find out if I never had another attack? Further more, if an airman lies and is in a serious accident with injuries or fatalities, his entire medical history will be examined and subsequent legal action may not be beneficial to his or her heirs. Just curious, as I am considering it and wondering about others experiences. Question:Do you think most pilots fib on applications for medical certificates? ASMEL, CFII, AME, Hi, Im currently a student pilot I finally saved up the money to go after my dream. I did years later and got totally cleared. I was just having so much fun and I didnt realize just how difficult it was going to be. Speaking as a pilot, I think that there should be a way to maintain certification for those of us flying recreationally without having to see an AME every 2 years. There are heart transplant pilots flying. I would like to see how many incidents of NOT seeking medical attention, due to knowing that the FAA will pull their ticket, have led to problems. I have informed my regular doctor to please clear with me anything they might write in my record, as it could affect my FAA medical. Due to the self-reporting nature, the chances of getting caught lying on an FAA medical arent very high. https://airfactsjournal-images.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/06180933/doctorlargesquare1.jpg, https://airfactsjournal-images.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/04/06142440/Air-Facts-Logo340.jpg, COPYRIGHT 2011-2023, SPORTSMAN'S MARKET, INC. All Rights Reserved. Stan, what is the diagnosis for which you have special issuance? During an FAA medical, a urine test will take place that checks sugars and protein levels. FAA Current Detailed Clinical Progress Notes. After numerous attempts I decided to contact the FAA of the situation so he would not get away with deceiving the AME again. Driving While Impaired (DWI) from alcohol, drugs, texting and exhaustion is obviously a serious problem and every driver self certifies, there is no evidence in the National Traffic Safety Data Base, that accidents caused by preexisting health conditions and the medications used for their treatment, is a major problem. Have you EVER been dizzy? In reality, all pilots (no matter what their license) self-certify their fitness to fly every time they fly. Also my flight instructor was telling me that he knew an applicant who lied about his criminal history for shoplifting and two to three months later the FAA found out and pulled his medical currently and he did not hear back for any clearance to fly again so these are great examples why not lie. Why is such a standard not imposed on motorcycle or car owners ? Lesson learned here is that not all Air Physicians are the same when it comes to evaluating pilots. A good AME will tell you how to jump through the hoops so that when you go for your FAA medical certificate, you have all the data needed for the FAA. On the subject of medical self certification, read the announcement by the AOPA and the EAA. In short, the FAA doesnt check medical records unless they have a reason to i.e. If you have determined that you are not healthy enough to fly sport, then you have done exactly what the Sport program is intended to do; leave the decision to the pilot. Maybe you think, John, that flying an aircraft with the grandkids by a pilot with diabetes, high blood pressure, 20/50 vision, and a coronary artery stent or 2 is just fine without jumping through the FAA hoops. I was diagnosed with PTSD from my service in the infantry Vietnam in 1968/1969 and have received counseling for it. They generally do not spend a significant amount of time reviewing each one. by Paul Engstrom, Aviation Writer and IFA Member. If they have any concerns about your eligibility to hold a medical certificate, AMEs can also deny your application or defer your certification to the FAA for further review. Its not lying its letting them find out, which would probably never happen unless something came out about it. At worse, you may face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. 13. My understanding is that the FAA cannot see your personal medical records without your permission so how are guys getting caught. They will also review how your current application compares to the ones you have submitted in the past and your driving record. I love flying and if I had to give it up, I know I would feel like part of me, and who I am, has been lost. Your signature at the bottom authorizes the FAA to search the National Drivers Registry for violations involving alcohol or illegal drugs, for instance, so you may want to think twice about trying to conceal a drunk driving conviction. And, actually, the FAA is making Special Issuance less of a problem for certain diseases. You would not be alone, as there are many older pilots that fly with conditions that would disqualify them from getting the Third Class medical. FAA Disqualifying Conditions: Bipolar Disorder. You definitely need to be in pretty good shape physically and mentally to be PIC, but I am really discouraged by the heavy-handed, intrusive, and IMHO borderline incompetent way the special issuance process works. I was always amazed at the high volume the Captains required. The airman who never was on medication for depression and certinatly never had a hospitible addmitance was now having to prove a negative. If anyone cares to share their thoughts or any advice I would appreciate hearing from you. If somebody had an experience with this, or knows somebody who has had that would be great if they are willing to share. From a practical standpoint, it makes the most sense. No mercy from the FAA and I was not even allowed to go to a hearing I just got the notice of revocation one day and that was it. The AME also cannot read their minds, so he cannot go beyond a reasonable interpretation either to help with these questions. Hes very consciencious, and does not tolerate much in the way of obfuscation, at which he appears to be very good at spotting. Do you need to have 20/20 vision to be a pilot? FAA needs to justify their man hours.with scapegoats. Students and young pilots just want to fly. You would be surprised how many complaints FSDOs receive for folks reporting their family members. Lie, definitely not. Yes, they do. what tests you need, when you need to take these tests, etc) to satisfy the FAA that youre good to go. The information request usually comes with a warning about certificate revocation and enforcement action if you do not respond within the period specified in the letter. Pilots aged 50 and older also have an intermediate visual standard measured at 32 of 20/40 or better in each eye separately. I dont think its ever been a question about whether pilots lie. I look at the FAA as the enemy trying to take my life away. Never happens! If they can get and autopsy on the pilot, they look for blood levels of the medications found at the crash site as well as illicit drugs that might be found in the pilots blood. He wouldnt go to hell and back (becoming a commercial pilot) if he didnt want his dream. That question cant be removed from the form easily, so you have the option of clicking the box labelled International or declining to provide and leaving the field blank. But have to retest for awake and alertness annually. Parasailing. They may only get 3rd class, but they are flying with strict guidelines on preflight accu check, inflight accu check, etc. Legally, it does have to be the original. The problem is cured now; they should be concerned when the problem exists not after the fact. I have been a private pilot since 10/05/2013 I know that the medical form is a self certifying process that can have good or bad risks but you never know what the FAA has access to since their a government organization/department. His point is that no one requires commercial The all have SODA and continue to fly. The problem is I was diagnosed with ADHD back when I was about 9. The process is so closed ,opaque, and bureaucratic. It revealed an abnormality. I then had to take an echo, which revealed I was even healthier than I thought! I have been flying with a special issuance 3rd class physical for 15 years. Is Medical Coding The Same As Medical Transcription? BINGO! I think that increasing the value of a worn out C150 to about $100K (which would happen the day they were included in the category) would take most of the trainer fleet out of circulation and the already paultry number of students would dry up completely. You can be fined up to $250,000 and jailed for five years for lying to the federal government. Im just grateful to have my medical and hope to keep it however long I have to have it. I had kidney stone surgery 12 years ago and over the last two years I passed two stones at home. I was an investigator for the CIA from 2001-2006 and armed security for CIA facilities for 4 years after that. Those pilots who lie on the FAA exams are likely to lie to themselves if/when they self certify etc. They didnt even send him a letter informing him about his conduct. Gee I wonder how many Pilots become depressed because of the hasseles from the FAA. Taint worth messing up folks. Find one that will work with you to meet the necessary requirements, but lying is not an option. Read from the question directly above the one you linked to: Long-standing FAA regulation, 61.53, prohibits all pilotsthose who are required to hold airman medical certificates and those who are notfrom exercising privileges during periods of medical deficiency. then are able to re-apply. I definitely do not lie on my medical application (8500-8) form because its a legal instrument. I am all in favour of your own doctors certificate of good health. So the Medical certification system is statistically, virtually, perfector..redundant AS LONG AS you are in a multi-crew aircraft. If you have any concerns about your next FAA flight physical. Certification of employees to preform tasks, medical and eye examinations are normal in the Aerospace industry. Thats just BS. Im old, crazy and hard of hearing bit like most experienced pilots I suppose. If the problem went away, petition the FAA to remove the requirement for special issuance. I would have assumed since this person had been flying for awhile, and flying solo that they would have imposed sanctions such as the ones discussed above. When that syndrome is cured, much of what is wrong at FAA will be cured. And yet still I do not feel I can speak freely to them. By now most of you know there are way too many federal employees standing around over paid and coming up with way too many regulations to try and justify their job. Pilots also fly without annual inspections, insurance and they might even go flying without getting a briefing first. People are willing to take the risks in exchange for their freedoms. An applicant who knowingly misrepresents the facts and gets caught can lose his or her pilot license forever and face a fine of up to $250,000, imprisonment for up to five years, or both. Before treatment, when I was sleepy, FAA wasnt concerned. Syed, If a question comes up about whether or not a pilot is qualified to hold an FAA medical certificate, the application itself usually does not contain enough information for AMCD to make a truly informed decision. There is something very wrong with a system when every one of its users hates it. Not just surprise test changes from the FAA but the FMCSA again wanting to reduce truck drivers hours of service due to fatigue despite the lack of evidence published on the FMCSAs own web site. Because of the Medical, no physician is my friend and neither are their nurses because they can enter accurate or inaccurate information into your record either one of which will condemn you. Others have their dreams dashed who lived years longer flying ultralights. I dont know for a fact other pilots lie on their medical, but pretty sure some I know do. Often it is not a case of pilots intentionally lying or withholding information that can get them into trouble, but ignorance of what they need to report. Delaying your AME appointment over several weeks to gather the right information can eliminate months of review by the FAA. Make no mistake: Form 8500-8 is a legal instrument, unlike many other documents. Did you know that most of the articles at Air Facts are written by readers like you? If your medical expires, there is nothing to stop you from continuing to fly. you say he flys solo whats it to you, Gee I fell out of bead a week ago and wacked my head I wonder if I should tell the FAA. Make no mistake,I have no problem with after finding an issue,we get it taken care of. Who would you send them to? Wouldn't it be nice if, when you opened up Med Expres, all the information that you had included in your last application was there for reference. I suggest that every pilot take a look at the AME Guide on the FAA website. If you have a medical issue, may god be with you as you try to figure out exactly what you have to do (e.g. Two years later fifty percent of the same Medical Board had differences of opinion, and being naturally frustrated I decided to visit UK, and was told by specialists there that systolic heart murmur does not prevent me from flying. But, it was not the fault of the FAA, it was mine for not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it. The FAA is not there to police, but to screen, monitor, and facilitate the safety of the public with respect to aviation. Why would you need to report that? May just you please lengthen them a little from next time? We are equally desiring of our freedom, but because we are a small group, the bureaucracy can get away with it. The FAA medical certification process starts when you fill out an electronic application in MedXPress. What makes an airplane as a machine so different. Unfortunately, this can result in some pilots opting to lie on their medical. Dont worry about getting caught unless you lie about you criminal history you will be fine. This is done by directly contacting you the pilot. If youre over 40 and your first-class medical is not renewed within six calendar months, itll revert to the privileges of a second-class medical for an additional six months. The simple fact is that the FAA generally trusts pilots. For over 50 years, pilots turned to Richard L. Collins for his unique perspective on the challenges and rewards of flying light aircraft. Thank you for the post. I am in full support of the exemption and hope you will support it too; after all, it has worked for the Sport program and it seems it will work for you! The med examination wasnt any different from the third class but the vision requirements are different. Its not a profession which that college students wake up and decide they want to fly a plane. If its temporary, shaddup about it. What does this mean? The FAA revised 61.53 to include under this prohibition sport pilots who use a current and valid U.S. drivers license as medical qualification.. Any help would be greatly appreciated thank you. If your nephew had his medical denied for 10 years, he must have been found to have epilepsy. Another friend had accompanied me to this testing and he sat across the table from me so that he could see the doctors actions. The AME Guide clarifies the question by explaining that it means unexplained unconsciousness.. If you have vision with only one eye, you can get a Statement of Demonstrated Ability (SODA) by taking a Medical Flight Test. How Likely is it that the FAA will Catch You? Where is this regulation? That cost me about six months of flying. Water under the bridge now 19 years later. Aside from that, I think that few pilots lie but, as Huck Finn said of Mark Twain, there was things which he stretched, but mainly he told the truth., See my comment about the unconsciousness question. If you had physician visits since your last FAA medical and a chronic illness was found that might, in the FAAs terminology, be disqualifying, ask your AME when you call to make the appointment if you need to provide some information from your treating physician. At a minimum, the liar can lose flight provileges for good. Yet, until recently, the FAA wouldnt allow any pilot to be treated with an SSRI (Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor) a medication with an excellent safety record concerning accidents. It is strongly advised that you seek the opinion and advice of a qualified aviation medical examiner and appropriate medical physician for any medical needs you may have. That is an entirely different responsibility that warrants a real physical exam. dangerous individuals about whom one reads in the news at 10. Needless to say, I dont have my class 3 medical now. NONE . I had the whole Combined Medical Board (CMB) certifying that I had systolic heart murmur that justified them to ground me from Air Force flying. However, if you do get caught, at best you will lose your license. Further, you fly with your family and maybe some of your employees if you use an aircraft for business transporation. Numerous attempts I decided to Contact the FAA medical certification system is statistically, virtually, perfector.. redundant long! Major airlines are in negotiations at this time, and I want to fly, now feds... 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